jonnyGURU Forums
Home Site Search Reviews Articles Contest Links PSU FAQs  


Go Back   jonnyGURU Forums > Computer Hardware > PC Power Supply Discussion

PC Power Supply Discussion Troubleshooting and discussion of computer power supplies

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 4 Weeks Ago
ashiekh's Avatar
ashiekh ashiekh is offline
20W User
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Grand Junction
Posts: 851
Thanks: 6
Thanked 53 Times in 50 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yaponchik View Post
Probably a second in duration though I would imagine it much lower. I am 100% sure that it is from the PSU as I can "feel" the sound, on the finger I use to switch the AC I/O to off.

The oscillator winding down as the capacitors discharge? I assume it is with the PC off, so the holdup time will be long.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 4 Weeks Ago
Yaponchik's Avatar
Yaponchik Yaponchik is offline
micro ATX User
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Pearl of the Orient
Posts: 9
Thanks: 2
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashiekh View Post
The oscillator winding down as the capacitors discharge? I assume it is with the PC off, so the holdup time will be long.
Hi Ashiekh,

I read this somewhere as well, that the capacitors discharging would be responsible for this sound and that it was normal... A lot of other people on the other hand, have been saying, such sounds isn't normal.

@jonnyGURU,

I am refraining from switching off the PSU although I will still try to replicate the problem... I hope that the built in safety features are enough to safeguard my equipment in case something goes awry...
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 4 Weeks Ago
ashiekh's Avatar
ashiekh ashiekh is offline
20W User
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Grand Junction
Posts: 851
Thanks: 6
Thanked 53 Times in 50 Posts
Default

I'm a bit like you, every little sound is the machine trying to tell me something, so I can sympathize that this may be driving you crazy; but in this case all may be fine. For example, my light switches sometimes give a pop when turned on, because I catch it when the AC is at a high point.


Another thought, although probably not relevant here

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yaponchik View Post
I actually have a better ground than the store, as they plug directly to wall outlet.
The ground is like a chain, only as strong as its weakest link; something extra isn't going to make for a better ground and might even make it worse.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yaponchik View Post
I am actually operating the UPS in AVR-high voltage sensitivity setting - where the UPS is aware that my CPU is sensitive to voltage fluctuations and waveform distortions, providing stable power delivery (the UPS AVR switches to battery power when voltage fluctuations are too high/low for it to compensate)
Is it a sine-wave UPS? If not it will be outputting a distorted waveform, and a good AVR uses the transformer windings to compensate for voltage fluctuations; switching to battery to compensate will wear out the battery.

Most modern power supplies can run on 110V, so a brownout on 220V is not really an issue (I'm assuming you are in Hong Kong).

Last edited by ashiekh; 4 Weeks Ago at 12:23 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 4 Weeks Ago
Yaponchik's Avatar
Yaponchik Yaponchik is offline
micro ATX User
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Pearl of the Orient
Posts: 9
Thanks: 2
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashiekh View Post
I'm a bit like you, every little sound is the machine trying to tell me something, so I can sympathize that this may be driving you crazy; but in this case all may be fine. For example, my light switches sometimes give a pop when turned on, because I catch it when the AC is at a high point.


Another thought, although probably not relevant here



The ground is like a chain, only as strong as its weakest link; something extra isn't going to make for a better ground and might even make it worse.



Is it a sine-wave UPS? If not it will be outputting a distorted waveform, and a good AVR uses the transformer windings to compensate for voltage fluctuations; switching to battery to compensate will wear out the battery.

Most modern power supplies can run on 110V, so a brownout on 220V is not really an issue (I'm assuming you are in Hong Kong).
Hi ashiekh,

Thanks for putting my mind at ease. Yes, every little thing counts and it is indeed, driving me crazy. Although the only "popping" I experienced is from my previous house, when using the induction stove together with the microwave and washing machine (dad life, you know) - the socket trips probably because of overloading the line.

I do understand the way you see electrical connections, specially grounding for this matter, and I am in 100% agreement. You can't shortchange something that would potentially save you from a massive power surge.

My UPS/AVR tech specifications are listed here and according to it, the waveform type is a "Stepped approximation to a sinewave." I am not in HK, but am couple of hours away (PHL), so the standard socket we have carries 220V.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 3 Weeks Ago
ashiekh's Avatar
ashiekh ashiekh is offline
20W User
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Grand Junction
Posts: 851
Thanks: 6
Thanked 53 Times in 50 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yaponchik View Post
the waveform type is a "Stepped approximation to a sinewave."

Which is a terrible distortion over a sine wave; if I were you I'd turn the AVR to less aggressive.

Ah, so "Location: Pearl of the Orient" is the Philippines, not Hong Kong

Last edited by ashiekh; 3 Weeks Ago at 05:30 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 3 Weeks Ago
Yaponchik's Avatar
Yaponchik Yaponchik is offline
micro ATX User
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Pearl of the Orient
Posts: 9
Thanks: 2
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashiekh View Post
Which is a terrible distortion over a sine wave; if I were you I'd turn the AVR to less aggressive.

Ah, so "Location: Pearl of the Orient" is the Philippines, not Hong Kong
Hi ashiekh,

What do you mean? I should change my UPS? Forgive my ignorance, but from the manual for AVR highlights:

Quote:
“Double boost and single trim” AVR instantly corrects
voltage fluctuations without using the battery, allowing you
to work indefinitely through inconsistent power, saving
battery life for outages.
And for the operation modes:



I am using the second to the last one. If my UPS is at fault here, please let me know. I would like to also know your suggestion, on what to replace it with.

As for location, it can refer to either HK or MLA
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 3 Weeks Ago
ashiekh's Avatar
ashiekh ashiekh is offline
20W User
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Grand Junction
Posts: 851
Thanks: 6
Thanked 53 Times in 50 Posts
Default

Ah, my bad; it doesn't use the battery for AVR, then all is fine(ish).

At the risk of worrying you further, there was quite a discussion of the problem with the stepped approximation to a sine wave
http://www.jonnyguru.com/forums/show...t=15730&page=4

where Per_Hanson pointed out some scary data relating to APFC (Active Power Factor Correction) power supplies running on such wave forms
https://digilander.libero.it/hibone/...est_Report.pdf

Location can be important when people are trying to figure out your voltage or what supplies are locally available.

One can drive oneself quite nuts with details like the stepped sine-wave approximation.

Last edited by ashiekh; 3 Weeks Ago at 01:44 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 3 Weeks Ago
Yaponchik's Avatar
Yaponchik Yaponchik is offline
micro ATX User
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Pearl of the Orient
Posts: 9
Thanks: 2
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashiekh View Post
Ah, my bad; it doesn't use the battery for AVR, then all is fine(ish).

At the risk of worrying you further, there was quite a discussion of the problem with the stepped approximation to a sine wave
http://www.jonnyguru.com/forums/show...t=15730&page=4

where Per_Hanson pointed out some scary data relating to APFC (Active Power Factor Correction) power supplies
https://digilander.libero.it/hibone/...est_Report.pdf

Location can be important when people are trying to figure out your voltage or what supplies are locally available.

One can drive oneself quite nuts with details like the stepped sine-wave approximation.
Hi ashiekh,

Worry me more, and I shall be pleased (the more you know, rght? ). This is an eye opener for me. I did quite a lot of research proceeding your comments about sine wave, and man, did those links you sent make sense.

Based on the links provided, stepped sine-waveform would work for my case, but is not recommended as there are unintended consequences of cutting short the PSU's component lifespan. That said, I did check the PSU while on, and there is a very faint buzzing sound. Literally, I would have to turn the PC off (so no fan noise) and put my ear literally to the metal (it's cold lol) to hear something ...

This is a by-product of the stepped sine wave of my UPS, I am led to believe?

Now I am itching to plug it directly to the wall for the first time since I got it and check that very very faint buzz ifit still exists.

With regards to power in my country, we have 220V delivered to the home @ 60Hz. I wouldn't say the electricity is garbage, but maybe every 3 - 5 years we get the random exploding transformer somewhere in the neighborhood (fixed by the electric company in an hour) and I'd imagine the surge causing that isn't good (killed off a DSL modem's power supply before) so I bought the UPS as added insurance.

It's basically the same with OP on the JG thread you provided, the highest end model available to consumers like me for my application is already this; there is one specific model consumers can get, which waveform is pure sine wave, but it costs thrice as much (US$600) and is rated 3000 VA / 2400 W.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 3 Weeks Ago
ashiekh's Avatar
ashiekh ashiekh is offline
20W User
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Grand Junction
Posts: 851
Thanks: 6
Thanked 53 Times in 50 Posts
Default

The stepped approximation is only for when the UPS is running on battery; you might want to try that, and then you will probably hear a lot more buzzing.

If you are only worried about surge, get a good surge protector; it will save you having to replace all those batteries every few years. My house is full of TrippLite isobar units

Last edited by ashiekh; 3 Weeks Ago at 03:11 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 3 Weeks Ago
jonnyGURU's Avatar
jonnyGURU jonnyGURU is offline
Site Founder
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: jonnyGURU forums, of course!
Posts: 14,610
Thanks: 456
Thanked 1,764 Times in 1,086 Posts
Default

Put the UPS back to normal mode. Your PSU is NOT subject to voltage fluctuations.
__________________
Rest in peace Mike Clements, aka "Yellowbeard"

Rest in peace Joerg Theissen, aka "GI Joe"
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:38 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright © JonnyGURU.com 2000 -