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Thread: Complete Review Methodology

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    Default Complete Review Methodology

    Call me slack now

    I can't find where the whole testing methodology is or any details of the PSU load tester and Oscope employed by Jon/Matt are. My search is not showing up anything - any help on this?

    At work, the hardware engineer came in to test with a industry lab certified PSU loader and the Oscope/Analyzer was a Tektronix DPO/DSA72004 while I curiously watched. Intriguing...

    I know bits and bats here and there of the method (i.e. Hotbox) but too much missing and for some reason I recall reading its somewhere I can't seem to find to refresh myself... and I wanted to ask some further questions about them.

    TIA

    ------
    EDIT: I'm reading something and I reckon it covers all I need to know before asking qs so hold the guns!!
    Last edited by Kab; 02-25-2007 at 01:22 PM. Reason: sametohatcharamaetch report

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    I use a SunMoon SM268+, and a USB Insturments DS1M12 Stingray and I have a Matrix MOS-620CH o-scope as well all of which are on loan from Jon.

    Jonny uses a Stingray as well (it acts as an o-scope but is read via software on the PC) and he's using the SunMoon SM8800 load tester which is like the 268 on serious steroids.

    The SunMoon 268+ reads 6 rails and has 5 programmable load ranges whereas the SM 8800 reads up to 10 rails and can run up to 10 programmable tests. I think it even allows the loads to ramp up from one test to another whereas the SM268+ is in steps.

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    This is the latest write up of the methodology: http://www.jonnyguru.com/new_testing/

    But I'm working on a newer one with better pics.

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    I'm sure your significant other really appreciates all that testing equipment on the table.

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    So does this mean I've got to make my own version of my methodology?

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    Umm... No?

    I'll mention the differences between yours and mine in the rewrite.

    You use a Kill-A-Watt to measure AC, right?

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    A Power Angel but yeah, same thing. I also run the PSU off the 2KVA UPS I run my PC on so my power is nice and clean

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    Gotcha.

    I use a 2000VA line regulator, but who's counting.

    Your hot box is different, but you mention that in the review so I'll add that as well.

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    Cheers guys

    Jon/Matt:
    On the SunMoons whats the maximum power it can deliver? Many load upto 600W max..

    Any dates when that section was last updated Jon?

    Do you still "warm" the PSU up for an hour or so before testing? In your test rig, why not populate it with some stuff inside to simulate more of a real working environment? As in reality you have very little room and each component absorbs as well as increases the total heat maintained inside and the CPU heat dissipating right onto the PSU is a big factor don't you reckon... ?

    Also the fans were of prime importance to me: how many exhaust fans do they each have and which ones (on the loader)? Most have around 4 80mm fans but of top quality.. although they be noisy at higher loads

    Also I notice the timescale of the ripple ridges .. if there were large fluctuation but the ridge width being very small (lets say 1ms) would you investigate that? I mean wouldn't that also count as to the more stability of the product and the "purity" of the supply than one with less although its inside the specification?

    I think one thing added for all who get dazed when looking at an oscilloscope is that the readings are measured in V/t graphs : voltage on the Y axis and time over the X axis. That makes it much better.

    Do both of you keep the ripple voltage and time frame at the same scales? Usually the squares across are 10 - I didn't count and the tabs closed now but it looked about the same on these ones.

    Are the testings carried out at the mfgs test states (lets say 50Hz instead of 60Hz or 230VAC instead of 115VAC) or with the American standard socket outputs? Because if the mfg tested it under say 50C ambient temps but rated the technical achievements at 230VAC, then the PSU can still be brilliant for the majority of user countries in the world but just not mainly US and Japan. Because 200VAC+ is used across the globe as the best standard and is the most cost effective, efficient, cheapest to pump out and supplies double the power than the 110-127VAC socket output and only those who couldn't move over didn't due to bad mistakes leaving it too late for them. So that would just mean a particular PSU is not suited (or simply crap) for the countries using 110-127VAC but still possibly excellent for those using double voltage outputs. (although 60Hz is much better than 50Hz aswell). With these load testers do you have the ability to compare with different AC inputs/frequencies?

    You probably have crocodile clips at the end of the BNC plug coaxial cable aswell?

    In that legitreview PSUs they tested, how did they manage to get 30A on 12V? Crossfire x1900 really did droop 360W on its own? But regardless most of the rest of the PSUs held up even at that uneven load?

    BTW first time I saw this review of yours Jon and I liked what I saw

    Oh and thanks for buying the equipments fellas. Gosh its expensive, tedious and a demanding but its nice to see the effort - much appreciated. You'll just get grey quicker than me I'm not picking any holes, just suggestions and the setup looks real good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kab View Post
    On the SunMoons whats the maximum power it can deliver? Many load upto 600W max..
    Only 600W? No way. The SunMoon's can test at least 30A per channel. Matt's has 8 channels. Mine has 10.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kab View Post
    Any dates when that section was last updated Jon?
    I dunno. Late 2005?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kab View Post
    Do you still "warm" the PSU up for an hour or so before testing? In your test rig, why not populate it with some stuff inside to simulate more of a real working environment? As in reality you have very little room and each component absorbs as well as increases the total heat maintained inside and the CPU heat dissipating right onto the PSU is a big factor don't you reckon... ?
    Not necessary.

    Read this:

    http://www.jonnyguru.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6

    Quote Originally Posted by Kab View Post
    Also the fans were of prime importance to me: how many exhaust fans do they each have and which ones (on the loader)? Most have around 4 80mm fans but of top quality.. although they be noisy at higher loads
    Fans of what? The load tester? The SunMoon uses a 120MM. This is blowing the hot air into the duct that's fed back into the case used for the "hot box" tests.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kab View Post
    Also I notice the timescale of the ripple ridges .. if there were large fluctuation but the ridge width being very small (lets say 1ms) would you investigate that? I mean wouldn't that also count as to the more stability of the product and the "purity" of the supply than one with less although its inside the specification?
    What are you asking?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kab View Post
    Do both of you keep the ripple voltage and time frame at the same scales? Usually the squares across are 10 - I didn't count and the tabs closed now but it looked about the same on these ones.
    Yes. The scale is captioned in the lower right of each screenshot. 2ms and 0.05V.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kab View Post
    Are the testings carried out at the mfgs test states (lets say 50Hz instead of 60Hz or 230VAC instead of 115VAC) or with the American standard socket outputs? Because if the mfg tested it under say 50C ambient temps but rated the technical achievements at 230VAC, then the PSU can still be brilliant for the majority of user countries in the world but just not mainly US and Japan. Because 200VAC+ is used across the globe as the best standard and is the most cost effective, efficient, cheapest to pump out and supplies double the power than the 110-127VAC socket output and only those who couldn't move over didn't due to bad mistakes leaving it too late for them. So that would just mean a particular PSU is not suited (or simply crap) for the countries using 110-127VAC but still possibly excellent for those using double voltage outputs. (although 60Hz is much better than 50Hz aswell). With these load testers do you have the ability to compare with different AC inputs/frequencies?
    Input voltage is American standard.

    If a company claims a PSU has 80% efficiency, but that's at 230V, and the PSU has only 78% efficiency at 110V, guess what? Not my problem.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kab View Post
    You probably have crocodile clips at the end of the BNC plug coaxial cable aswell?
    No. Not at all.

    Read this:

    http://www.jonnyguru.com/forums/showthread.php?t=164

    The SunMoon load tester is made specifically for the testing of ATX power supplies. It has a BNC output to hook an Oscope up to.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kab View Post
    In that legitreview PSUs they tested, how did they manage to get 30A on 12V? Crossfire x1900 really did droop 360W on its own? But regardless most of the rest of the PSUs held up even at that uneven load?
    I have no idea what you're talking about.

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