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Thread: PC Dillema (extremely strange happenings) / New Build Required? [Help]

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    As an mATX is there any issues with heat dissipation or excessive wear if running for extended periods or time? Like being left on 24/7 for weeks on end (not that that will always be the case but sometimes it might).
    It's not a latex suit nor a guillotine blade.. why would it ware out?
    The answer is no, very low heat output from the motherboard(low power chipsets and a very efficient VRM).

    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    Also, IF I never actually ended up OC'n the 2500k or putting in a faster CPU (I'm not opposed to OC'n I just might not even feel the need to do it because this will already probably be fast enough for all apps/games - at least by my standards), would it basically be a waste to spend the extra on this board because it's known to be a good overclocker and support superior clockspeeds (or that CPU for that matter)?
    Yes, if you don't intend to overclock the CPU there's no point in paying a premium for the motherboard and the unlocked CPU.

    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    Am I right when I'm thinking none of these components you listed me really seem like "budget" components anyways but rather the best $/performance for people who know their research and don't like paying more for essentially enthusiast level performance then they need to?
    That is correct.
    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    It's perhaps a tad more than I was expecting to have to spend (only cuz i'm tight on cash atm which normally would not be a problem) but like I said numerous times, seeings how I'm just going for the CPU/MB/RAM this month I might as well get the good stuff right? So that way when I do get the extra cash for the SSD, the GPU and a new Cooler for OC'n presumably there won't be any bottlenecks? Even if I only get around to it say 3 to 4 months down the road? Things might have evolved quite a bit by then?
    That's a solid approach.. but again, if you don't intend to overclock the CPU(which would be a shame considering how easy it is with SandyB) there's no point in buying the 2500K and the Gene-Z.
    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    PS - I've still got Prime95 torture test (max memory) running (3+ hrs now) on the POS (Piece of Shit) Cooler Master 460W PSU and with one stick of memory in the first slot on the P5E and still not a single error. Just like it was with memtest. Makes no sense to me... if the memory controller is fucked then surely by now after almost 10 hrs of continous memtest and prime95 something would have popped up no?
    No.
    Again, do what I told you, it's simple and it will settle it one way or the other.

    ps. 5 more questions, after that I'll start charging you
    "Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar" - Unknown (but sometimes attributed to Sigmund Freud)

  2. #22
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    As an mATX is there any issues with heat dissipation or excessive wear if running for extended periods or time? Like being left on 24/7 for weeks on end (not that that will always be the case but sometimes it might).
    No, unless you don't know what you're doing, however if you don't, you may have the same issue in ATX case as well. I've been running in mATX case for ~3 years.

    Other than less expansion ports (of PCI/PCI-E kind), there is no inherent downside for mATX board. Some even support SLI/CF.

  3. #23
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    1-900-ORIGINAL-SIN only $99.99 / min - I wish x)

    Hmm... you think I should buy this and overclock right off the bat??? You say it's easy... how easy....? The last time I OC'd it was on a Athlon XP 3200 and a Barton XP 2500 so you get an idea, OC'n has probably changed quite a bit since then? I recall it was a pain in the arse on some of those, I can't remember how many hrs and days and nights I spent in the BIOS uping voltages and trying every single possible increment and memory timing and running 3D mark and prime95 and memtest benchmarks. x)

    Is this thing OC'able on the stock cooler? Until I can get around to buying an after market? Even a mild overclock... but at least an overclock making it worth the while to buy this board and cpu?

    I mean how much of an approximate % improvement am I can get by OC'n? Is it really worth it with CPU's this fast? If I don't OC what would be the right MB/CPU to get then and how much would I really save lets say presuming I wanted the performance of the current CPU at stock speeds. I mean it must be pretty decent already even at stock speeds? I'm probably not going to save 160+ Euros by doing that now am I? And how would that impact when I stick a powerful GPU in there some months down the road? Bottlenecks?

    PS - I wish I could get some of these other guys on the forums who I know are knowledgeable to help out so you don't have so many questions to answer all on your own! Or they're just sitting giving you a round of applause (or perhaps shaking their head in dismay at my wall of text!)

    @rafal I would be running it in a shit ATX case initially. But I always leave my cases WIDE open so air flow is not a concern. Probably dust is more of a concern but i vacuum / dust the PC's every few weeks or so and live in a clean house. Honestly I should really invest in a good case and close it up. I've just always had shit cases my whole life with crap airflow and fans so my solution was always just pfft fuck that open case and temperatures always drop like mad! Maybe that's what's killing all my hardware though? I didn't think running open cases was that bad though and honestly I don't notice any more dust building up in than if it was closes really. I'm probably wrong on that but hey. I always felt keeping things as cool as possible (can't get any cooler than room temp without water) then you need a good case with good airflow if you wanna close it all up. Winter is great though, open up the window a little and room gets real cool. Summer though definitely not good for PC's, massive desk fan by the case anyone? LOL summer without air con is definitely not the PC season. Which is fine, forces you to go out and enjoy the weather.

    In all seriousness though it's almost midnight where I am currently, I should probably put the order in and make a purchase so I can hopefully pickup the components before New Year this Saturday when everything closes and build it up on the next Monday or wtvr. Can anyone think of any reason why I shouldn't pull the trigger on this one? Is no one gonna try and talk me out of this or sell me something else? Some Corsair perhaps? LOL Is Original Sin really that spot on with his picks? Cmon' DAMN someone make me doubt something or make me feel like I'd be spending too much or too little on this setup or should be looking at something else! lol x) Everyone seems so agreeable here on JonnyGuru.com, or maybe Original Sin built all your systems? I kid I kid...
    Last edited by bobdob; 12-29-2011 at 06:16 PM.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    Hmm... you think I should buy this and overclock right off the bat??? You say it's easy... how easy....?
    CPU overclocking has never been easier.. you only need to change a multiplier in BIOS.
    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    Is this thing OC'able on the stock cooler? Until I can get around to buying an after market? Even a mild overclock... but at least an overclock making it worth the while to buy this board and cpu?
    The stock cooler is good for about 4Ghz on most 2500K samples, but it's pretty noisy at those clocks.
    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    I mean how much of an approximate % improvement am I can get by OC'n? Is it really worth it with CPU's this fast?
    Depends entirely on the workloads the system will be dealing with.
    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    If I don't OC what would be the right MB/CPU to get then and how much would I really save lets say presuming I wanted the performance of the current CPU at stock speeds. I mean it must be pretty decent already even at stock speeds? I'm probably not going to save 160+ Euros by doing that now am I?
    CPU -> 2320 @ 170€
    PSU -> OCZ ZS 550 @ 57€
    RAM -> Kingston HiperX Black 8GB 1600Mhz @ 40€
    MoBo -> MSI P67 C45 @ 95€
    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    And how would that impact when I stick a powerful GPU in there some months down the road? Bottlenecks?
    Not the case.. unless you're putting 2 or more high end GPUs on that platform, you won't hit any CPU bottleneck.
    "Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar" - Unknown (but sometimes attributed to Sigmund Freud)

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    Hmm so we have.... the RAM is only 5 EURO difference and rated at the same speed so why not go with the G Skill right? Presumably it's better you suggested it first for the OC orientated system? PSU's are both OCZ 550W what's the difference exactly? The more expensive has slightly better components?

    Biggest difference is clearly the mobo being almost half the price. And you're saying the 2320 is basically equivalent in speed to the 2500k but simply doesn't have the OC potential? Problem is the 2320 is apparently not in stock at that store so i'd have to wait over a week. I wonder if my other system will last that long.

    Hmm tough choice. Which one do you guys think I should go for? Considering I don't plan on upgrading this system again for at least 3-4 years (minus sdd, a good gpu etc. which will come in a 3-4 months). Damn I hate picking new systems. :P Honestly though Original Sin you're beyond helpful in all this. I wish there was a way I could repay you.

    Anyway I think I've been doing this too long it's time to choose. Any last advice from anyone on board? Which route would you go? Save 153 EUROS by going cheaper mobo/cpu or go for what appears to be the best mid-high end and have the OC capacity to get even more out of the system over the coming years?

    Which out of these two systems is the better $/performance is the 153 EURO question? x)

    ----------------------------------------------------

    OPTION 1:

    ALL FULLY IN STOCK AVAILABLE WITHIN A COUPLE DAYS

    CPU -> 2500K @ 210€
    PSU -> OCZ ZT 550 @ 80€
    RAM -> G.Skill RipjawsX 8GB 1600Mhz @ 45€
    MoBo -> Asus Gene-Z Gen3 @ 180€

    TOTAL: 515€

    ---------------------------------------------------

    OPTION 2:

    ONLY CPU IS OUT OF STOCK 7 OR MORE DAYS

    CPU -> 2320 @ 170€
    PSU -> OCZ ZS 550 @ 57€
    RAM -> Kingston HiperX Black 8GB 1600Mhz @ 40€
    MoBo -> MSI P67 C45 @ 95€

    TOTAL: 362€

    ---------------------------------------------------

    OPTION 3: None of the above :x
    Last edited by bobdob; 12-29-2011 at 07:12 PM.

  6. #26
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    Original Sin is dead on in his components selections. These are proven selections.

    To answer your question about OC'n, yes. I would install the os and perform a burn in at stock speeds to be sure of stability. After the burn in and stability checks I would then mildly OC it. Stock frequency is 3.3, I would OC it to 3.7 or 3.8 as 3.7 is where the "turbo boost" would boost it up to anyhow. At this point enjoy.

    One more reason to get the Asus Gene-Z motherboard is mostly because of how utterly well built and solid it is, even if you never OC it.

    Have a good one

    Edit: kyle of Hardocp.com recently reviewed the newest Intel CPU's and concluded for his personal system refresh he would use the 2600k rather than any of the newest release CPU's. He has also said many times the 2500k and 2600k are superb performers and great deals for the enthusiast. He calls it the way he see's it, good, bad, or indifferent. I recently built a budget gaming system for my sister that used the 2500k and the Asus Gene-Z and the same ram as listed above. It works great, she loves it. One difference was she bought a 560 GPU, which for her should last the life of that GPU. She did not go with the SSD, as it would have blown her budget, besides she can always buy one and add it in later. I admit, SSD's are quite nice and getting better all the time.
    Last edited by diriel; 12-29-2011 at 07:19 PM. Reason: Additional Info

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    Hmm so we have.... the RAM is only 5 EURO difference and rated at the same speed so why not go with the G Skill right? Presumably it's better you suggested it first for the OC orientated system?
    If you look carefully you'll notice a voltage difference between the two kits, the GSkill will allow for higher memory overclocks.. not that important really.
    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    PSU's are both OCZ 550W what's the difference exactly? The more expensive has slightly better components?
    They're build by different OEMs, the ZS is not modular while the ZT is fully modular.
    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    Biggest difference is clearly the mobo being almost half the price.
    The motherboard still allows you to overclock the CPU, but unlike the Gene-Z, it is not a performer in this regard(weaker VRM), but since you won't have a fully unlocked CPU it won't matter anyway, you won't push the board to its limits.
    Also this is a P67 board(not a Z68 one) which doesn't allow to use the IGP, but that's not an issue since you intend to use the system with a discrete card anyway.
    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    And you're saying the 2320 is basically equivalent in speed to the 2500k but simply doesn't have the OC potential? Problem is the 2320 is apparently not in stock at that store so i'd have to wait over a week. I wonder if my other system will last that long.
    The 2320 is a "limited unlock" part.. meaning, it has a maximum Turbo Boost multiplier of 37(3.7Ghz) which makes it identical to the stock 2500K.
    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    OPTION 3: ???
    Hookers?
    ------------------------------

    I'm out.
    "Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar" - Unknown (but sometimes attributed to Sigmund Freud)

  8. #28
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    If you carefully comb all the websites you will find almost no disappointment with the Asus GeneZ or the I5 2500K.
    You will find that not every chip overclocks to 5 GHz or more.
    If you go with the MSI board check price on an I5 2400 if you cannot wait.

    FWIW (it is not my money) the better board will work longer, harder and faster, and retain more value at a future date.

    Big ? is what sacrifices would have to be made over the three months to pay off the extra 125 Euros.

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    Yeah I'll go with option one recommended by original sin, that GeneZ does look pretty sweet indeed.

    Doubt I'll get it before the New Year though at this point, I should have ordered it last night but hey it got just too late. Mind you I could get lucky if I ordered it today but it's not like I'm gonna have time to install any OS on it anyway at least until Sunday or Monday and I highly doubt I'll be in any state of mind to build a PC on Sunday so I should probably wait I guess. Even I with all this pc talk I really don't wanna. X)

    Besides my P5E and pos 460w psu seems to start up and shutdown normally again. It Booted up fine again this morning. WTF? This is beyond annoying, I was rushing the purchase on this precisely because the p5e wouldn't boot up the other day (or so thought it was the psi) and now it does!?! Seriously WTF. Is this normal for so called memory controller issues with motherboards? If that is indeed the problem with it in the first place. One day it doesn't work at all and the next day just after move the ram around some more just as I had the day before, switch psu switch psu back again and then it all works again just fine? Wtf. Should I just roll with it as long as its working or just dump it ASAP?

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    Also, some good news, I just got off the phone with the store and they'll take Corsair HX750W PSU back for reimbursement no problems.

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