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Thread: PC Dillema (extremely strange happenings) / New Build Required? [Help]

  1. #11
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    @original_sin Problem is I'm currently in France so the online shop is in French (SORRY I'm sure that's the last thing you wanted to hear lol - don't worry though the site seems obvious and intuitive for the most part you shouldn't have any prob even if you don't speak a word of FR), I use this shop the most (links below) because you can order it and then pick it up yourself the very next day usually. Although it should be pretty self explanatory I'll link you to the specific categories (below).

    Budget I mentioned above is somewhere between 300-500 EUROS. If it's closer to 500 EUROS or slightly more I can pay in 3 times over 3 months so that's still doable. If it's closer to 300 EUROS or 400 EUROS then I'll probably just pay it all in one shot and be done with it. Like I said though I'm willing to be a little flexible with going over budget a little bit if really necessary to get a substantially better PC and increase the $/performance ratio although I doubt it will really be necessary with how overpowered hardware is now a days anyways.Ideally I'd like this system to last a few years or more, I'm not the type who likes to buy new systems every year or two just to always have the latest and greatest. I like good $/performance that lasts and has no issues running the latest software or games (I don't need ultra performance i just need to be run everything smoothly). But I don't like to skimp too much on performance just for the sake of saving a buck.

    I think yeah to start all I would need is CPU/MB/RAM. GPU I can still use my 8800GT for now. And I guess a new PSU if I'm returning the HX750 (which i paid 140 euros for!) ? Like I mentioned a bunch already though I do have a HX620W but it needs to be RMA'd and I don't have time to wait for that and that CoolerMaster PSU I linked to above I just feel dirty with that in my system. Although if it can do the trick until I RMA the HX620W then I'm not opposed to using it for a few more weeks (if it's actually not broke) but keep in mind RMA = postage costs etc so i might just be better off putting that money towards a new PSU. I'll need a new case also because the one I'm using currently is beyond awful but I can wait also for that, it's not the case impacts performance anyways and in terms of cooling I just leave it open anyways so.

    Motherboards: http://www.materiel.net/cartes-meres/
    Processors: http://www.materiel.net/processeurs-pc/
    Memory: http://www.materiel.net/barrette-memoire-pour-pc/
    Power Supplies: http://www.materiel.net/alimentation-pour-pc/

    Graphics cards
    : (like I said I can wait on GPU though and use my 8800GT for a few more months so don't necessarily factor this into the budget - but eventually in a couple months or so I would like to get a nice new powerful gpu capable of handling all the best games for the coming few years - i don't think i'd ever want sli or anything like that though - i always figure one good gpu is better and more than enough) http://www.materiel.net/carte-graphique/
    Cases (like gpu not necessary can wait): http://www.materiel.net/boitier-pc/

    Upgrade kits (as they call them - basically bundles of CPU/RAM from what i can see - not sure what the point of this is as it's probably cheaper or the same to buy the pieces individually, perhaps i'm wrong though i don't know i just figured i'd post the link for the hell of it): http://www.materiel.net/pack-composants-de-mise-a-jour/

    And if necessary http://translate.google.com/ and http://www.xe.com although you can just post up here if you want me to assemble you links to specific lists like list all Socket XYZ CPU's in DESC price or wtvr if you can't figure it out and then I'll post the direct link so you can get an overview of what they're offering. By the way did I mention you guys rock for helping me out like this on such short notice! Much respect!

    Is any of this making any sense? x) If not please let me know and we can just build the system on newegg or some english site and then i can just try and find the same components on the French site on my own. Problem of course they don't have all the brands necessarily, newegg obviously has the best selection and is in a totally different league compared to this site.
    Last edited by bobdob; 12-29-2011 at 01:34 PM.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    @original_sin Problem is I'm currently in France so the online shop is in French (SORRY I'm sure that's the last thing you wanted to hear lol - don't worry though the site seems obvious and intuitive for the most part you shouldn't have any prob even if you don't speak a word of FR)
    Actually I do speak French, sort of.. been a long time, but I did read Descartes in French which is a feat for a non native speaker

    Anyway, sorry for the late comeback.. kinda' busy at the moment

    MoBo -> Asus Gene-Z Gen3 @ 180€
    RAM -> G.Skill RipjawsX 8GB 1600Mhz @ 45€
    PSU -> OCZ ZT 550 @ 80€
    CPU -> 2500K @ 210€
    CPU Cooler -> Thermalrigh HR 02 Macho @ 44€
    VGA -> ASUS 560Ti 448 Cores DCII @ 310€

    ^this is, more or less, a perfect build.. all you need to add is a decent SSD, buy what you can afford for now and add the rest later.. the case is a matter of taste but I'd probably pick a mATX case for that build
    "Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar" - Unknown (but sometimes attributed to Sigmund Freud)

  3. #13
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    Hmmm looks interesting. I've never personally owned a micro ATX before (despite what my forum user title says ) I guess that's indeed a good way to shave off the cost?? Smart! Are their any cons to getting an mATX?

    That CPU is pretty much the best $/performance on the market currently without spending excessive amounts as far as I can tell from most review sites (correct me if I'm wrong). Would it be possible to run it on stock cooling initially? Also what's with the Graphic HD 3000 listed in the specs? Is that like some sort of on board graphics card built into the CPU? What the hell? Wasn't aware they were doing that now (see how far behind I am in the hardware scene). :P

    What's the FSB on the CPU? I can't seem to find it listed on the specs. Will it run 1:1 ratio with the RAM? ie. do the FSB's match or? Probably a stupid question I know.

    Also re: the PSU I thought OCZ's were known to be poor when it came to PSU's? I mean for example if the store refused to take back the HX750W for whatever reason (because it was opened and used for all but a few hours) then would there be a problem if I used the HX750W? That's IF they don't take it back, French retailers can be pretty pathetic when it comes to that sort of thing, if it was unopened there wouldn't be a problem but who knows what they'll say now that I've opened it (very carefully mind you). Any advice on the reason I should give for returning it? I obviously don't want to say there's anything wrong with it. What about something stupid like it doesn't fit in my case, it just wasn't what i expected, or what? Anyone have experience comping up with reasons to return these sort of things?

    Re: the RAM I see a lot of people recommending Ripjaws RAM on this board and elsewhere, I guess there's a good reason for that. Never tried G Skill RAM but I take it must be good.

    Re: the VGA that sounds good indeed, I think I should probably wait on the GPU a couple months though, obviously my 8800GT will work in this without problems right?

    Thanks again for all the help I really appreciate you taking the time out to help me on such short notice.

    Does anybody else have any feedback also? More opinions are welcome. Ideally I'd like to put this purchase through within the next few hours. Unfortunately no time for research on this build so I'm relying on your guys expertise!
    Last edited by bobdob; 12-29-2011 at 03:09 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    Hmmm looks interesting. I've never personally owned a micro ATX before (despite what my forum user title says ) I guess that's indeed a good way to shave off the cost?? Smart! Are their any cons to getting an mATX?
    I didn't suggest this board because it helps shave off cost, but because is the best SandyB motherboard on the market except for the Maximus Extreme which comes at twice the price...
    There are no drawbacks other than the limited space which can be an issue with multi-VGA setups.
    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    That CPU is pretty much the best $/performance on the market currently without spending excessive amounts as far as I can tell from most review sites (correct me if I'm wrong).
    That is correct.
    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    Would it be possible to run it on stock cooling initially?
    Yes, but it's a monster overclocker and you really need a solid aftermarket cooler to put that CPU to proper use
    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    Also what's with the Graphic HD 3000 listed in the specs? Is that like some sort of on board graphics card built into the CPU? What the hell? Wasn't aware they were doing that now (see how far behind I am in the hardware scene). :P
    That's exactly what it is, an integrated graphics processor.
    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    What's the FSB on the CPU? I can't seem to find it listed on the specs. Will it run 1:1 ratio with the RAM? ie. do the FSB's match or? Probably a stupid question I know.
    The FSB is history, the clock generator is locked, that's why you're getting an unlocked CPU(K suffix) which comes with an unlocked multiplier
    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    Also re: the PSU I thought OCZ's were known to be poor when it came to PSU's? I mean for example if the store refused to take back the HX750W for whatever reason (because it was opened and used for all but a few hours) then would there be a problem if I used the HX750W? That's IF they don't take it back, French retailers can be pretty pathetic when it comes to that sort of thing, if it was unopened there wouldn't be a problem but who knows what they'll say now that I've opened it (very carefully mind you).
    Yes, some OCZ power supplies are poor, the recent ones however are good to excellent(ZS, ZT, ZX).. the ZT 550 is a very solid unit and it's fully modular which adds a lot of value to a mainstream unit.
    There's no problem with using the HX750, but that's a lot of PSU you don't need and won't use and a lot of money you didn't have to spend or could have spent better
    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    Re: the VGA that sounds good indeed, I think I should probably wait on the GPU a couple months though, obviously my 8800GT will work in this without problems right?
    Right.
    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    Does anybody else have any feedback also?
    No.
    "Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar" - Unknown (but sometimes attributed to Sigmund Freud)

  5. #15
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    Love the last quote reply! A decisive NO! lol I don't hear anyone objecting though.... x) You definitely seem pretty sure of yourself. I suppose that's a good thing! (for me)

    Let me ask you though, in all honesty, when you were putting that system together looking through that French site, did you ever find yourself having to make sacrifices or being forced to compromise on parts that normally you would have picked others for instead? For example because they didn't stock a particular brand or model, or their prices seemed completely out of whack or something along those lines? Or did they pretty much seem to have all the "usual suspect" components you would have looked for on any other site based on what you know to be the best $/performance parts currently out there (whether USA based sites or not)? Or perhaps because the budget I gave was too low?

    Also Re: the IGP (int graphic proc) on the 2500k - is it in the actual CPU itself? Didn't they used to include these things on mobos? Why did they start putting them directly into the CPUs? I take it it's the same concept though, ie. if your PCIe card is out of action or wtvr at least you can still boot up and use your PC. How does the connectors work to connect it to your DVI or wtvr? That part must still be on the mobo i take it?

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    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    Let me ask you though, in all honesty, when you were putting that system together looking through that French site, did you ever find yourself having to make sacrifices or being forced to compromise on parts that normally you would have picked others for instead? For example because they didn't stock a particular brand or model, or their prices seemed completely out of whack or something along those lines? Or did they pretty much seem to have all the "usual suspect" components you would have looked for on any other site based on what you know to be the best $/performance parts currently out there (whether USA based sites or not)? Or perhaps because the budget I gave was too low?

    Nothing to worry about really, it's not a system built on compromise, as you already saw, I couldn't care less about your budget.. If I were building it for me I'd probably change the cooler with this and add this SSD, maybe change the PSU with the Be Quiet E9 580 because it's inaudible, the rest would stay exactly the same.

    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    Also Re: the IGP (int graphic proc) on the 2500k - is it in the actual CPU itself? Didn't they used to include these things on mobos?
    Yes and yes.
    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    Why did they start putting them directly into the CPUs?
    Simple answer: to get rid of the north bridge and fuck nVidia.
    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    I take it it's the same concept though, ie. if your PCIe card is out of action or wtvr at least you can still boot up and use your PC. How does the connectors work to connect it to your DVI or wtvr? That part must still be on the mobo i take it?
    To use the IGP you need a motherboard with one of the following chipsets: Z68, H67, H61, Q67, Q65 or B65; and the motherboard also needs to have some video output ports.
    Since there are two chipsets that will allow CPU overclocking(P67 and Z68) and only one of them lets you use the IGP if you so choose(Z68), your only option is a Z68 board
    "Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar" - Unknown (but sometimes attributed to Sigmund Freud)

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    Hmm so from what I'm reading this motherboard will be a pretty substantial upgrade from what I have currently and allow some future proofing also (for when I'm ready for the new GPU etc.) even if that is a few months down the road. This sounds like a system that would be able to run the latest games and apps for several years no problem. Certainly not the "budget" system I was expecting based off my estimated budget (yeah you went a tad over but seeings how I'd be buying in bits and not all together it's not as bad I suppose). I would have preferred something a bit cheaper but I think then I'd probably sacrifice substantial performance from what I'm understanding, can anyone confirm this?

    Is this the exact mobo? http://www.guru3d.com/article/asus-m...gene-z-review/ What's the "Gen3" bit? Is it like Rev 3? Sounds like this sucker is really built for OC'n.

    Does anybody here have any actual hands on experience with this board? Any additional feedback would be cool.

    Re: the IGP it's only got an HDMI out on that mobo from what I'm seeing. So I would have to have an HDMI converter or something to use it (i don't think i have an hdmi cable just dvis and vgas - altho i might somewhere i'd have to check)? Not that I plan on really using it regularly I just think it's a cool idea to finally have an onboard display adapter in case I have ever have issues with PCIe ones. It will also likely help when troubleshooting a system (god forbid). FYI this is the monitor I've got currently LG IPS231P-BN http://www.materiel.net/ecran-lcd/lg...-bn-64549.html and I'm planning on eventually getting a second one for dual display. But obviously I have other expenses to worry about first.

    Also SSD's seem pretty pricey but I do definitely want one, it's been years i've been hoping to get one. However seeings how I clearly can't buy it all at once, would you recommend as with the GPU I leave it alone for now and just continue using my regular old SATA's (they are pretty damn old - 6 or more years - hopefully they'll last a few more months tho). Or would you recommend I sacrifice the mobo/CPU or some RAM to be able to save some money and include an SSD right off the bat? That'd probably be pretty stupid right? Obviously the MB/CPU/RAM are the most important core to any machine, in particular when it comes to future proofing it a little (ya ya i know wtvr good that does - likely none considering how fast hardware goes). :P
    Last edited by bobdob; 12-29-2011 at 04:45 PM.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    Is this the exact mobo? http://www.guru3d.com/article/asus-m...gene-z-review/ What's the "Gen3" bit? Is it like Rev 3? Sounds like this sucker is really built for OC'n.
    Gen 3 is the latest revision which includes PCIe 3.0 support.

    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    Does anybody here have any actual hands on experience with this board? Any additional feedback would be cool.
    Yours truly, what would you like to know?

    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    Re: the IGP it's only got an HDMI out on that mobo from what I'm seeing. So I would have to have an HDMI converter or something to use it (i don't think i have an hdmi cable just dvis and vgas - altho i might somewhere i'd have to check)? Not that I plan on really using it regularly I just think it's a cool idea to finally have an onboard display adapter in case I have ever have issues with PCIe ones. It will also likely help when troubleshooting a system (god forbid). FYI this is the monitor I've got currently LG IPS231P-BN http://www.materiel.net/ecran-lcd/lg...-bn-64549.html and I'm planning on eventually getting a second one for dual display. But obviously I have other expenses to worry about first.
    That's an excellent monitor.. and yeah, you'll need an adapter.
    Quote Originally Posted by bobdob View Post
    Also SSD's seem pretty pricey but I do definitely want one, it's been years i've been hoping to get one. However seeings how I clearly can't buy it all at once, would you recommend as with the GPU I leave it alone for now and just continue using my regular old SATA's (they are pretty damn old - 6 or more years - hopefully they'll last a few more months tho). Or would you recommend I sacrifice the mobo/CPU or some RAM to be able to save some money and include an SSD right off the bat? That'd probably be pretty stupid right?
    That's entirely up to you, an SSD completely changes the experience and a system like this deserves one.
    "Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar" - Unknown (but sometimes attributed to Sigmund Freud)

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Original Sin View Post
    Yours truly, what would you like to know?
    As an mATX is there any issues with heat dissipation or excessive wear if running for extended periods or time? Like being left on 24/7 for weeks on end (not that that will always be the case but sometimes it might).

    Also, IF I never actually ended up OC'n the 2500k or putting in a faster CPU (I'm not opposed to OC'n I just might not even feel the need to do it because this will already probably be fast enough for all apps/games - at least by my standards), would it basically be a waste to spend the extra on this board because it's known to be a good overclocker and support superior clockspeeds (or that CPU for that matter)? I usually look at OC'n when I feel the need to boost the system without a full upgrade (that was not always the case but since my last system it has become so), although I suppose that sort of logic is flawed as I experienced with my Q6600 G0, basically it was the same situation I'm in now, perhaps I spent more on a CPU and MB and higher clocked RAM then I really needed at the time purely because I thought "hmm a few years down the road when this isn't fast enough it is known to be a good and easy OC'er", but usually before I get a chance to reach that point some part of the system has already failed and I find myself in a situation as I am now where the tech is obsolete and no longer sold in any stores so the only option is to really just buy a whole new build. Rinse and repeat. Makes me wonder. x)

    Quote Originally Posted by Original Sin View Post
    That's entirely up to you, an SSD completely changes the experience and a system like this deserves one.
    Yeah that's what I'm thinking but if I did it right off the bat I'd have to knock at least about 160 EUROS or more off the CPU/MB/RAM in one shape or form.

    Doubt there's any way to do that without a severe compromise in quality of one or all of those components and basically truly dropping the machine into the so called proper "budget" category. Yeah it will still probably "okay" for just regular apps and what not but in a year or two if ever some heavy duty app or game comes along that I "need" to use then I might have some regrets huh? Not to mention how much stress I can put on a system, a budget system would probably degrade pretty quickly with the amount of stress I put my machines through.

    Am I right when I'm thinking none of these components you listed me really seem like "budget" components anyways but rather the best $/performance for people who know their research and don't like paying more for essentially enthusiast level performance then they need to? It's perhaps a tad more than I was expecting to have to spend (only cuz i'm tight on cash atm which normally would not be a problem) but like I said numerous times, seeings how I'm just going for the CPU/MB/RAM this month I might as well get the good stuff right? So that way when I do get the extra cash for the SSD, the GPU and a new Cooler for OC'n presumably there won't be any bottlenecks? Even if I only get around to it say 3 to 4 months down the road? Things might have evolved quite a bit by then?

    PS - I've still got Prime95 torture test (max memory) running (3+ hrs now) on the POS (Piece of Shit) Cooler Master 460W PSU and with one stick of memory in the first slot on the P5E and still not a single error. Just like it was with memtest. Makes no sense to me... if the memory controller is fucked then surely by now after almost 10 hrs of continous memtest and prime95 something would have popped up no? Strange. Now I feel like I'm buying a new PC even though my old one is now working again WTF (for how long though I suppose that's the question). Not POST'n for a day straight then suddenly working again can't be right. /scratches head

    PC hardware really pisses me off sometimes... feels like "planned obsolescence" is truly at the core of their manufacturing process. It wasn't always this way I don't think, but I suppose as the hardware gets more and more complex and more and more powerful and intricate there's more and more chances for just a little thing to fuck everything up. /sigh Then again maybe I'll just blame it on Bethesda! x)

    I like how no one else is replying in this thread except Original Sin. lol They're probably all like "WTF is this... WALL OF TEXT nooo must look away!"
    Last edited by bobdob; 12-29-2011 at 05:34 PM.

  10. #20
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    Get the SSD later. About mid year some refreshes will most likely be out and things will be even better buying wise for SSD's.

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