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Thread: Does power supply performance 'decrease' over time?

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by sdbardwick View Post
    Maybe...
    Depends...

    Varies on each platform

    Here's a good read over at [H]ard|OCP

    One thought... testing equipment also ages over time; so one might wonder about how often recalibration is done.

    Semiconductors if run very hot will suffer diffusion which can change their characteristics, but in a well designed unit (i.e. running components within specs) these changes will be small. Now it might be argued that if the fan ages then the supplies cooling ability is compromised.

    I recap old supplies, oil the fan and then consider them just as capable as when they were new.
    Last edited by ashiekh; 04-11-2019 at 08:11 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ashiekh View Post
    One thought... testing equipment also ages over time; so one might wonder about how often recalibration is done.
    Annually.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stefan Payne View Post
    Ähm, I think we are talking past each other.
    I wasn't talking about Capacitors or what they do or don't do.

    The "PSU Degrading" Claim is that the PSU loses wattage over time for whatever reason.
    Usually the Claim is 25% or whatever they feel like it. For a long time the "beloved" Outervision PSU Calculator also propagated this nonsense as well.

    Anyway, there are the HardOCP Reviews on one hand and an older Computerbase Review made by Philip that show that PSU don't degrade over time. Ripple might get worse, yeah, maybe but that's about it. They do not lose capacity at all! They are all still able to do their rated Wattage at full load (and room temperature)...
    https://www.computerbase.de/2013-11/...etzteile-test/

    Not that I would advocate for using such old PSU with modern Components anyway...
    When one data set says they can lose capacity and another says they don't one can't say "They do not lose capacity at all!" since the data says otherwise. But why let data get in the way of your story? The real answer is "it depends" but since some have been shown to lose capacity you are incorrect, again, Stefan.

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    All of that is interessant, but how can a mere user tell when his PSU is losing its punch due to the infirmities of old age?

    The 750W Seasonic that the [H]OCP team reviewed, for example, had a 5y waranty, yet after 10y of steady use the power was undiminished and it still passed its ripple. So when do we decide the PSU is going bad? If we have 650W and 750W X-series Gold PSUs, do we run the computers they are on until they die? The CPUs will be outmoded then, and if Intel the MBs will not be compatible with newer CPUs. The effect of higher ripple would be to degrade and finally kill the MB, so should we let them all grow old and die together?

    This is not a theoretical question for me, since my oldest CPU is an i7 4770K, 6y and 6 generations older than the 9th generation of CPUs now current. And right behind that is the i7 4790K, 5y and 5 generations older than current CPUs. Both of these are powered by now-old X-series like the one that was reviewed, though a few years younger. Since I lack the O-scopes and the know-how to measure ripple, I am left guessing, or removing the PSUs on predictions alone; and as I said, the computers they power are no spring chickens and do not perhaps deserve new PSUs, especially on a guess.
    Core i7 4770K @4.3GHz + iGPU | GA-Z87X-UD4H | 2x8GB Crucial Ballistix DDR3@1600MHz
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    Good point, but some people run their machines for quite a while; my main machines at home are about 10 years old and still going strong. I anticipate another 5 years perhaps.

    In the old days after 5 years a computer was no longer useful; this has changed.

    My car is over 20 years old and still going strong.

    So some power supplies may be called upon for 20 years of duty.
    Last edited by ashiekh; 04-12-2019 at 09:24 AM.

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    So the answer to the 'degrading' claim is 'it depends'?
    Wonder if degrading can surpass and affect rated output...

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    I'd say the fan was also a point of concern, perhaps even the main concern.

    100,000 hrs is just over 11 years and some dual ball bearing fans are only rated for 50,000 hrs

    A degraded fan will derate the power supply and so performance will 'decrease'
    Last edited by ashiekh; 04-12-2019 at 09:48 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rgbodosk View Post
    So the answer to the 'degrading' claim is 'it depends'?
    Yes, that is correct.

    Quote Originally Posted by ehume View Post
    All of that is interessant, but how can a mere user tell when his PSU is losing its punch due to the infirmities of old age?
    You can't really. Well, until you go beyond it's abilities

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    Lucky for me that all of the machines I built are way overpowered, so they do not strain their PSUs. Also, if the PSUs lose Max power, who cares? As long as the ripple does not kill the aging MBs and HDs I'm OK. I guess the only thing to worry about is the bearings of the fans. Luckily, the PSUs all have fans that don't spin when the wattage is low, prolonging their lives.

    I guess this all goes to prove that buying big PSUs is a good thing. I guess 850W being the lower end of the Corsair premium line is a good thing.
    Core i7 4770K @4.3GHz + iGPU | GA-Z87X-UD4H | 2x8GB Crucial Ballistix DDR3@1600MHz
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    Samsung 840 Pro 512GB SSD | WD Black 4TB file disk | WD Red 3TB backup disk
    Fractal Design Define R5 case w/2 x NF-A14 ULN front fans | no exhaust fan; grill removed
    PSU Seasonic X-650 Gold

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    No it doesn't, it proofs that quality is important.

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