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Thread: PSU "tier list"

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    Default PSU "tier list"

    I'm at it again!

    And I'm very far behind. But I'm determined to get it done this time!

    While this isn't a "tier list" that tells you what to buy using subjective opinion, this is a data base that tells you housing depth, topology, warranty, protection IC, fan bearing type, etc.

    Anything with a "?" is something that I've researched but couldn't find a definitive answer. Anything that's blank is something I haven't gotten to yet.

    Any input is appreciated! You can comment on the sheet or here in this thread.

    I want this to be the mother of all PSU lists!

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing

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    We have much info in the Cybenetics evaluation reports, which you are free to use of course. We actually measure PSU depth, cabling etc and don't rely on the specs (which our way out some times). For many PSUs there is a part analysis table as well.

    Yes it is nice to have all gathered together into a single sheet. However since the data will be enormous maybe it would be better to make separate tabs for each brand.

    About the temperature rating, if the PSU has been reviewed and survived for example at 47C with full load (or more), you could use this temperature as max. After all the majority of units claiming to be able to deliver full load continuously at 50C can only do so under some specific conditions (and many of them not even that).

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    Quote Originally Posted by crmaris View Post
    About the temperature rating, if the PSU has been reviewed and survived for example at 47C with full load (or more), you could use this temperature as max. After all the majority of units claiming to be able to deliver full load continuously at 50C can only do so under some specific conditions (and many of them not even that).
    No. That would be gross negligence.

    By IEC standard, if a PSU is "rated" at 50°C, it should be able to do so 24/7 for life. If they don't, it's false advertising, but I do not have time or resources to weed all of those out and neither do you.

    Many PSUs might be able to survive 47°C for an extended period of time, but if you test them longer or at another time, or at cycles that allow the components to cool before being heated back up to 47°C again, they may fail. This does not make them 50°C rated... or even 40°C rated.

    This is why we do actual DMTBF testing at Corsair, and cycle a number of samples at high temperatures over an extended period of time before passing a PSU.

    No reviewer does this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jonnyGURU View Post
    No. That would be gross negligence.

    By IEC standard, if a PSU is "rated" at 50°C, it should be able to do so 24/7 for life.
    How is life defined?

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    Quote Originally Posted by jonnyGURU View Post
    No. That would be gross negligence.

    By IEC standard, if a PSU is "rated" at 50°C, it should be able to do so 24/7 for life. If they don't, it's false advertising, but I do not have time or resources to weed all of those out and neither do you.

    Many PSUs might be able to survive 47°C for an extended period of time, but if you test them longer or at another time, or at cycles that allow the components to cool before being heated back up to 47°C again, they may fail. This does not make them 50°C rated... or even 40°C rated.

    This is why we do actual DMTBF testing at Corsair, and cycle a number of samples at high temperatures over an extended period of time before passing a PSU.

    No reviewer does this.
    Sounds like industrial QC, done by a responsible seller.
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    Tier 1 manufacturers already do this. Flex, Delta, Great Wall, FSP....

    Most others don't unless requested. Like CWT, Seasonic, etc. We (Corsair) actually had to document a DMTBF plan for these vendors and pay out the nose for test unit cost, power consumption and labor.

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    Do you know how many units I have destroyed personally by testing full load at 50C and not for very large periods. Most of them were rated at 50C This is why I decided to drop to 45C.

    Yes no lab can do this for a great number of PSUs at least, this kind of torture testing. But it can test under much harder conditions to speed things up and see if the PSU will actually deliver at 50C. This is what we do during our beta test evaluations.

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    I assume the power supply is tested in the open; in real life it is fighting with other fans to extract air from the case, so the flow will be less than when just sitting in the open.

    To thermally de-rate for testing is scary.

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    Quote Originally Posted by crmaris View Post
    Do you know how many units I have destroyed personally by testing full load at 50C and not for very large periods. Most of them were rated at 50C This is why I decided to drop to 45C.
    My point exactly. They shouldn't be rated at 50°C then. That's false advertising and those vendors need to be called out.

    Now... Keep in mind that there is a difference between "operating temperature range" and "rated temperature". The verbiage used is not very clear.

    Many PSUs can say they have a "operating range" of 0 to 50°C. But that only means that the PSU can operate at 50°C, but not at full load. There is a de-rate that is often not disclosed. So as a marketing "trick", they will state "operating range", but this does not mean that the PSU can operate at full load at those temperatures.

    That's why in my tier list, if they say "operating temperature range" in their marketing, but doesn't actually say something like "850W @ 50°C", I will not list them as being capable of running at full load at 50°C.

    Quote Originally Posted by ashiekh View Post
    I assume the power supply is tested in the open; in real life it is fighting with other fans to extract air from the case, so the flow will be less than when just sitting in the open.

    To thermally de-rate for testing is scary.
    What power supply is tested in the open? Who are you referencing? Not sure I understand your point. You're not testing at 50°C "in the open".

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    Quote Originally Posted by jonnyGURU View Post
    What power supply is tested in the open? Who are you referencing? Not sure I understand your point. You're not testing at 50°C "in the open".
    It was an assumption, and I meant in unrestricted 50°C air.

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