Page 4 of 12 FirstFirst ... 23456 ... LastLast
Results 31 to 40 of 114

Thread: Facing a strange issue with Corsair CX550

  1. #31
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    348
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    14
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    3
    Thanked in
    3 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jonnyGURU View Post
    I've never heard of anyone having issues with simulated sine wave and a CX PSU. But, then again, I have no idea how wonky the sine wave is on your UPS.
    What?
    There is no such thing as "simulated sine wave"
    It's just UPS manufacturers marketing bullshit for a modified square wave output UPS!
    What they tell you in their marketing:



    What it really is: (blue line)



    Any such UPS can damage the bulk filtering capacitors in a PSU.
    That is because to achieve ca 230v RMS they have to output a very high square wave voltage.
    In some UPS designs this can equal a voltage higher than what the bulk filtering capacitor is rated for.

    whitestar_999: buying another shit UPS is not the solution
    Your issue indeed seems to be related to the holdup time of the PSU.
    Maybe as explained above the bulk filtering caps degraded a bit and you have a shorter holdup time in the PSU.
    Or maybe the UPS degraded a bit and now has a longer switchover time than it used to.
    You'd be surprised how shitty some of them are designed, many have been repaired on the Badcaps forums...
    Anyway, the real solution is to use a double conversion UPS.
    Such a UPS always runs the inverter and thus there is no switchover time when the power fails.
    The downside is that they are more expensive than a regular online UPS.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    "The one who says it cannot be done should never interrupt the one who is doing it."

  2. #32
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Location
    India
    Posts
    38
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    0
    Thanked in
    0 Posts

    Default

    @Per Hansson thanks for the reply & I am already aware of double conversion UPS but it is not possible for me(or anyone else) to buy such a UPS in my country simply to run a desktop. These models exist in my country only for 2000VA & above & are sold as Airconditioner UPS & cost almost same & sometimes more than an entry level desktop itself. Also my situation is not so unique(aka activePFC psu+modified sine wave output UPS) because most people in my country(& I assume everywhere else too) use such UPS only with such psu. My only concern is now to find suitable VA for such UPS.

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    jonnyGURU forums, of course!
    Posts
    15,929
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    528
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    208
    Thanked in
    152 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Per Hansson View Post
    What?
    There is no such thing as "simulated sine wave"
    It's just UPS manufacturers marketing bullshit for a modified square wave output UPS!
    Maybe it's the different vernacular used between our language uses (including the fact that your English is very proficient), but the term "simulated sine wave" is used interchangeably with modified square wave, quas-sinusoidal, PWM squarewave, etc. It's often referred to "simulated" because its overall shape closely resembles an ideal sine wave with peak voltages close to an actual sine wave. But at the end of the day, pick your descriptor without being disrespectful to those who use a different one than you.

    To say that one is not a substitute term for the others is like saying a hot dog cannot be a sandwich.

    There are lot of "technically incorrect" terms used in this level product. Like saying a PSU has "DC to DC" (they all do!) or referring to output voltages as "rails".

    Now... that said, it could be such a generic UPS that it doesn't even have a modified simulated PWM square-maybe-not too square quasi-sinusoidal sine wave (threw as many adjectives in there as possible just to piss you off) and be a simple square wave output. While the PSU wouldn't be reacting to the lower peak voltages of the wave (I wouldn't think so), it could be reacting to harmonics that it can't handle. The fact that it worked initially, but not now, could mean imminent failure of either the UPS (if the output is actually degrading) or the PSU itself.

    And whitestar: No reason to buy a super expensive UPS. Consumer grade UPSs are widely available to the general public because THEY WORK 99% of the time. If your UPS is so shitty that you dare not speak it's brand name in fear of repercussions from Beelzebub himself, then just buy a decent SIMULATED SINE WAVE UPS and call it a day.

  4. #34
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Location
    India
    Posts
    38
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    0
    Thanked in
    0 Posts

    Default

    ^^Well it's not like I can afford a super expensive UPS anyway

    So how about a 600VA APC UPS like this one:
    https://www.amazon.in/APC-BX600C-600.../dp/B016XVRKZM
    Is it enough for CX550(more specifically is it enough for successful switchover)?

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    348
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    14
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    3
    Thanked in
    3 Posts

    Default

    Yea JG my wording maybe looked a bit like I was attacking you, my intention was to attack the marketing that UPS manufacturers use, they piss me off :P

    Anyway, there is a quite extensive list of UPS inverter waveforms here.
    Some quite cheap UPS's even come with real sinewave output...

    https://www.hardwareinsights.com/dat...put-waveforms/
    "The one who says it cannot be done should never interrupt the one who is doing it."

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Location
    Grand Junction, CO
    Posts
    1,900
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    108
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    44
    Thanked in
    38 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by whitestar_999 View Post
    So how about a 600VA APC UPS like this one:
    https://www.amazon.in/APC-BX600C-600.../dp/B016XVRKZM
    Is it enough for CX550(more specifically is it enough for successful switchover)?
    Lithium Polymer battery... nice, but still just 360W

    Average battery life: 3 years, not so nice

    Capacity 4.2 Watt hours which means it will hold up a less than a minute at 360W


    You pick a unit very similar to the one that did not work for you and ask if it will work; how can we know? Do you know anyone with a UPS who would be willing to let you try your PC on it?
    Last edited by ashiekh; 05-17-2018 at 02:06 PM.

  7. #37
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Location
    India
    Posts
    38
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    0
    Thanked in
    0 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ashiekh View Post
    Lithium Polymer battery... nice, but still just 360W

    Average battery life: 3 years, not so nice

    Capacity 4.2 Watt hours which means it will hold up a less than a minute at 360W


    You pick a unit very similar to the one that did not work for you and ask if it will work; how can we know? Do you know anyone with a UPS who would be willing to let you try your PC on it?
    Please don't take it otherwise but you seem to be forgetting my situation in your recent replies. My PC does not/can not use even 300W(Pentium G620+1050Ti). I have an inverter battery backup for mains so I only need a few seconds for successful switchover between UPS & inverter battery backup. My current UPS is a generic one supposedly much inferior to APC(kinda like generic no name 500W psu vs 500W seasonic,even if they both have same wattage there is no competition,right?).

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Location
    Grand Junction, CO
    Posts
    1,900
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    108
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    44
    Thanked in
    38 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by whitestar_999 View Post
    My PC does not/can not use even 300W...

    On start up a power supply can take 10 times or more current/power than usual (as the primary capacitors fill/refill), so this might be what is tripping the UPS; some power supplies have a softer start than others. What might be happening is that during the time it takes the UPS to switch in the battery the power supply has drained its primary capacitors to some extent and they need refilling. You may only be taking 200W of a 360W capacity, but this initial demand could trigger overload. The problem is that an NTC (Negative Temperature Coefficient) resistor is often used to limit the inrush (high resistance when cold, low resistance when hot), but will still be hot when the UPS switches over, so there is no inrush limiting in your case.

    For the sake of argument let us suppose the above mechanism is in play, and that a weakening battery is why you didn't see it before; this suggests that a higher power UPS is likely to be more tolerant of such a surge.

    My very first reply suggested that the battery may be overloaded

    Quote Originally Posted by ashiekh View Post
    Seems to me the issue is with the low power UPS and not simulated/pure sine wave; the battery may be old (360W at 12V means 30A)

    https://www.upsbatterycenter.com/12v...h-f1-terminals

    has a maximum discharge rate of 18A (5 sec)
    Not meaning to be rude, but it would have been helpful if you had checked what battery it has. It is very hard for someone to say if another UPS of similar rating will work or not (even your present UPS worked initially).

    If a UPS is overloading its battery, I'd say the UPS design was at fault and not the power supply, even if the battery will hold out initially. I have been known to modify a UPS to take larger batteries so that those batteries would not be over taxed, and concerning using another battery for trials, they just need to be connected

    Quote Originally Posted by whitestar_999 View Post
    ... not possible to match them without some serious hardware modification...
    no hardware modification needed for a test; that is why I suggested a car battery, but...

    Quote Originally Posted by whitestar_999 View Post
    I can assure you experimenting with car battery is not a feasible idea in the place I live.
    If I had to guess, a new battery for your present UPS might solve the problem, but it would not be a good solution. I even asked

    Quote Originally Posted by ashiekh View Post
    What are temperatures like out there?
    as it affects battery life, but no answer. This is why I eventually replied

    Quote Originally Posted by ashiekh View Post
    I don't think I can be of much more assistance, sorry.

    It may amuse you to learn that I once lived on the Navajo Nation, where electricity is not so reliable, and to keep my heated blankets running I needed sine wave UPS units, and even then only some such units would work; but batteries are expensive and since moving I no longer use UPS units.
    Last edited by ashiekh; 05-17-2018 at 06:00 PM.

  9. #39
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    jonnyGURU forums, of course!
    Posts
    15,929
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    528
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    208
    Thanked in
    152 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by whitestar_999

    So how about a 600VA APC UPS like this one:
    https://www.amazon.in/APC-BX600C-600.../dp/B016XVRKZM
    Is it enough for CX550(more specifically is it enough for successful switchover)?

    Nice price for a Li-ion UPS. Considering the CyberPower w/ lead acid batteries isn't much cheaper, I'd go with the APC.

  10. #40
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Location
    Grand Junction, CO
    Posts
    1,900
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    108
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    44
    Thanked in
    38 Posts

    Default

    I'm waiting for super-capacitor units to cover glitches.

    http://www.instructables.com/id/Conv...er-Capacitors/

    also tried to figure out how to keep lead acid batteries from sulfating

    http://www.instructables.com/id/Reve...cid-Batteries/


    Even wondered about a homemade flywheel UPS where a motor runs a generator with a flywheel in-between; but 1W costs $1 a year, so costs would add up.
    Last edited by ashiekh; 05-17-2018 at 06:50 PM.

Similar Threads

  1. Strange difference between Seasonic and Corsair PSU fans
    By danda821 in forum PC Power Supply Discussion
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 03-14-2018, 09:11 AM
  2. Are Corsair CX450, CX550 and CX650 all the same platform?
    By jmcyang in forum PC Power Supply Discussion
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 03-12-2018, 10:49 PM
  3. Silverstone SST-ET550-G vs Corsair CX550
    By CrapXon in forum PC Power Supply Discussion
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 11-23-2017, 12:32 PM
  4. Corsair AX1200i has a strange model number written on
    By solomonshv in forum PC Power Supply Discussion
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 05-17-2016, 05:31 PM
  5. Hi! ...strange issue with an Antec!
    By heinz357 in forum PC Power Supply Discussion
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 03-19-2012, 11:15 PM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •