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Thread: Silverstone ST80F-TI Review

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    It looks like you got less ripple than Aris did when he reviewed the unit, especially on the 5v rails, about 20mV less.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nuckles_56 View Post
    It looks like you got less ripple than Aris did when he reviewed the unit, especially on the 5v rails, about 20mV less.
    I thought it was weird how at 80% and 90% load with Aris' sample it has >50mv of ripple but went back down to 26mv with 100% load. Something doesn't seem right with that sample Aris had or there was some fault in that measurement. http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/...su,4600-9.html

    Edit: Actually, it did the same thing on the 3.3V and 5VSB rails for Aris.

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    Quote Originally Posted by turkey3_scratch View Post
    I thought it was weird how at 80% and 90% load with Aris' sample it has >50mv of ripple but went back down to 26mv with 100% load. Something doesn't seem right with that sample Aris had or there was some fault in that measurement. http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/...su,4600-9.html

    Edit: Actually, it did the same thing on the 3.3V and 5VSB rails for Aris.
    Has to do with the frequency of the LLC resonant converter.

    His load pattern is not the same as Jeremy's and most likely showed a worst case scenario as the switching frequency most likely had to spike high in order to maintain that load level, and thus introduced a ton of extra ripple into the circuit.

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    I think it may also be about the measurement device. I think here we all have three different pieces of HW to load the units. Some may introduce some capacity, some may introduce some induction into the circuit. Or something completely different, god knows. Each unit also reacts different. Than you can get resonance and all these nasty effects.

    My long-term opinion is manufacturers should test or have units tested by different ppl on different HW to see if it works OK under different scenarios. Almost everybody in the high-end using Chroma means they may never find any flaws which just do not happen using Chroma. I still remember Zalman rep arguing with me my measurement is broken because they had great results on Chroma. Yeah, OK, that may be, or may not. I don't know. What is exactly the reason my results are bad? That is something I never learned from them

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    Using CHroma right is a whole new different story. The best equipment hardly is of any use if you don't know how to use it. I often found flaws in PSU brand's measurements. Wrong tests, wrong Chroma settings, not suitable devices, wrong reading of the results. If they don't know what they are doing even the Chroma setup is of very limited use.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Philipus II View Post
    Wrong tests, wrong Chroma settings
    That may need to elaborate a bit more: how those can be wrong, why that Zalman rep could have been so confident in his Chroma reports...
    Best, Luca

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    Zalman uses probably Chroma 8800 ATS controlled by Chroma Power Pro software. If you program the load testing the wrong way you also get results, but the results are worthless. Also some hardware configs of the Chroma 8800 ATS have problems with certain tests and don't provide the precision you need. Operating such test equipment is for professionals, but the job is often performed by amateurs who only know the basic features.

    In the last couple of years I found several problems with Chroma testing of several factories and brands. Some results have simply been wrong and others have been useless because of the selected settings. If settings don't match ATX/Ecova/real world conditions you ahve to be very careful with interpretation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Philipus II View Post
    If you program the load testing the wrong way you also get results, but the results are worthless
    Thanks a lot Philip: I was interested to know what actually happens in those scenarios (wrong setting, wrong tests, which results, why they are useless), I mean, sort of anecdotal evidences or limited case studies, if any.
    Best, Luca

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    Some examples I've seen and I can share:
    - wrong preset of the timing noise analyzer->sytematically low ripple
    - wrong step time/size for protections check ->protection only kicks in when load increase is very fast. If load increase slower PSU dies.
    - wrong preset of the load modules ->reduced precision of current/voltage readings. I've also seen protections of the Chroma load modules kick in because of configuration problems.
    - not knowing the limitations of timing noise analyzer -> missing very short spikes
    - wrong oscilloscope settings (bandwith not limited to 20 MHz. Time not long enough to see "full cycles" so they didn't actually ripple from max to max but just the noise plus some ripple)
    - test time per item too short. Not enough time for the PSU to heat up and be in steady state.
    - PG time measurement only for hold up time
    - wrong cabling (mixed up +12V rails, connectors connected to load modules not in use), wrong asignment of load modules to rails via software.
    - wrong Chroma Hardware setup (wrong small capacitors for ripple&noise measurement so results can't be compared to any spec/other tests)
    - wrong settings for standby measurements (time, average over this time)
    - lack of EMI shielding of the test lab (some funny results for ripple&noise and transients)
    - current record of incompetence: Wrong load calculation (was claimed to be according to 80 Plus formula, but in fact wasn't)

    This list is endless. Everything they can mess up sooner or later somebody will. Even factories which can do good analysis/reports (CWT, I've seen the Corsair reports which are good) will mess up other testing completely.

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