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Thread: Preview: SilentiumPC Enduro FM1 550 W (SPC118) @HWI

  1. #31
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    I don't agree here (that it costs more to get Platinum than Gold @230 V). The usual practice is you take Platinum platform (strip rectifier and PFC transistors, use smaller coil) and make it Gold @230 V. Just as with all the other platforms (Bronze as basic 230V etc.). At least that's what I've seen so far. Couple OEMs and distributors agree with me that the way Ecova did it is just dumb. More of them actually don't care about any certification anymore (if they ever did).

    Super Flower's wannabe plans are nice, but until they build second fab of their own (not some OEM rebrands) and make proper QC instead of more units, they are just that: plans. Now their non-EVGA units availability is too limited and the soldering was a mess (from what I've seen) as they are rushing it out from the line.

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    You have much to learn, grasshopper. ;-)

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    Quote Originally Posted by turkey3_scratch View Post
    Well I understand that it costs more money to reach 80Plus Platinum than 80Plus Gold EU, so in terms of a money sense, 80Plus Gold EU does equal 80Plus Gold since it would cost marginally more money to develop an 80Plus Platinum PSU vs an 80Plus Gold EU PSU over a normal 80Plus Gold PSU. On the other hand, the percentages are equal for the efficiency levels that must be met are the same. So, what I can deduce that it is merely a subjective matter which is why none of you can recah an agreement. Subjective things never reach agreements, since there is no factual conclusion, only opinion.
    Just read Philips post and mine and ignore Behemot. What's not clear then?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Behemot View Post
    The usual practice is you take Platinum platform (strip rectifier and PFC transistors, use smaller coil) and make it Gold @230 V.
    Well, if you do it like this Gold 230V will be too expensive. Most companies start with the Gold model, cut cost in the primary stage and check how much tuning is actually needed to meet 230V EU. Especially at full load the gain from higher input voltage is usually big enough. Low load can be a problem depending on design.

    Super Flower is the only one publically announcing their Gold 230V plans, but there are several more. Even LC-Power and Xilence are offering 230V certified units now. If you prefer your sources over the guys who actually work with OEM I won't comment on it any more.

    Also I realyl should find the time to post the pictures of the RSY factory. I've actually been there this spring.
    Last edited by Jon Gerow; 07-13-2016 at 11:22 AM.

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    No, it is clear now. 80Plus Gold EU = 80Plus Gold because although the percentages are higher 230V is more efficient, and an 80Plus Gold PSU tested on 230V will maybe reach 80Plus Gold EU levels. Makes sense now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Philipus II View Post
    Well, if you do it like this Gold 230V will be too expensive. Most companies start with the Gold model, cut cost in the primary stage and check how much tuning is actually needed to meet 230V EU. Especially at full load the gain from higher input voltage is usually big enough. Low load can be a problem depending on design.

    Super Flower is the only one publically announcing their Gold 230V plans, but there are several more. Even LC-Power and Xilence are offering 230V certified units now. If you prefer your sources over the guys who actually work with OEM I won't comment on it any more.
    I know about those platform, they are already in Ecovas list. I repeat with the SF, they most likely won't be able to get some interesting numbers to Europe, if any at all. Those LC-Power units seem interesting though.

    Maybe it is as you say for higher-efficiency platforms. But in lower efficiency segment they usually really take e. g. Bronze platform and just make it EU standard. CWT GPM is an example.
    Last edited by Behemot; 07-13-2016 at 02:53 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by turkey3_scratch View Post
    No, it is clear now. 80Plus Gold EU = 80Plus Gold because although the percentages are higher 230V is more efficient, and an 80Plus Gold PSU tested on 230V will maybe reach 80Plus Gold EU levels. Makes sense now.
    Well almost, it's not the same but a PSU that can do 80PLUS Gold should be able to do 80PLUS Gold 230V with sometimes some minor tweaks, the costs should be around the same for both and the efficiency numbers on 230V should also be comparable.

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    Quote Originally Posted by -The_Mask- View Post
    sometimes some minor tweaks
    For cheap low-efficiency platforms, yes, there you easily achieve much higher efficiency with minor tweaks. The higher the efficiency already is, the lower the gain from higher input voltage. Remember than the only thing the input voltage affects is PFC efficiency. It is usually the least efficient part of the whole PSU. But for high efficiency platforms (Gold, especially Platinum and Titanium) the efficiency is already at its limits and overall for the whole power supply, increasing PFC efficiency alone won't be enough.

    Just look at the Enhance Titanium platform, it hardly makes it now. If we take that graph posted here for 800W version, it does not stand a chance to make it to 80 PLUS Titanium 230 V. The 600W version is even worse there. Even making it semi-fanless most likely won't be enough (though these couple watts will help greatly at 10% load). This is ofc platform-dependent, some Platinum platforms have high reserves, but still, further 2 % at 20% load takes some effort. For example the SF Leadex Platinum will not make it. Makes me wanna say gotcha!, but I won't be so mean

    Actually, not even the 850W versions is even close. The 1600W version I cannot check, the review is broken, I can not see the graph. BTW, according to this, the EVGA/SF unit does not even pass 80 PLUS Platinum (@115 V), dafuk? Higher temperature?
    Last edited by Behemot; 07-13-2016 at 03:18 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by turkey3_scratch View Post
    So are we saying that a PSU with universal voltage running on 230V is less efficient than a PSU that can only run on 230V???
    Nope, we do not.

    All we said is that running off the higher voltage is more efficient under higher loads because you need much less amperaage (about half).

    For example:
    a 1000W unit @ 115VAC needs about 10 Amps max.
    a 1000W unit @ 230VAC needs about 5 Amps max.

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