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-   -   Seasonic Prime 750 Review (http://www.jonnyguru.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13529)

Oklahoma Wolf 08-15-2016 08:36 AM

Seasonic Prime 750 Review
 
Quote:

At long last, we have a new power supply from Seasonic to take a look at. It is one of their brand new flagship series of units bearing the "Prime" moniker. Boasting things like super stable voltage stability, a ten year warranty, and ultra low ripple; the marketing department at Seasonic has been writing an awful lot of checks about these units. Let's see if the unit can cash them.
http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php...Story&reid=481

HX520 08-15-2016 08:44 AM

Impressive. Too bad about the hefty $179 price tag though.

VSG 08-15-2016 08:51 AM

Great review, great unit. Well done, Seasonic!

Does the EVGA 750 P2 at $130 not affect scoring here? 80+ Platinum units were used before when rating 80+ Titanium units.

schnopsnosn 08-15-2016 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VSG (Post 128234)
Great review, great unit. Well done, Seasonic!

Does the EVGA 750 P2 at $130 not affect scoring here? 80+ Platinum units were used before when rating 80+ Titanium units.

Well, the EVGA 750 T2 is $189.99 in the EVGA-store, so I don't see an issue with that.

Where I personally see an issue is the retail pricing in Europe. The lowest price for that unit I can find is 215,92.

HX520 08-15-2016 09:08 AM

Scan has it for 189.99. The G-750 is 100 and the HX750i (Platinum) is 132.99, so I don't think it's worthwhile at that price...

breixobaloca 08-15-2016 09:09 AM

The things that most impressed me were the capacitors. Nippon Chemi-Con series I NEVER saw on PSUs. Someone know about it?

CE on primary and W on secondary. I don't see any info on the website. Interesting :)

And of course, nice review.

Orion 08-15-2016 09:12 AM

Not enough Transformers puns, 2/10 review git gud.

Quote:

<music break - same annoying Fall Out Boy song over and over and over and over and...>
SOME LEGENDS ARE TOLD
SOME TURN TO DUST OR TO GOLD

This ripple without cable caps is very impressive.

breixobaloca 08-15-2016 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orion (Post 128238)
Not enough Transformers puns, 2/10 review git gud.

SOME LEGENDS ARE TOLD
SOME TURN TO DUST OR TO GOLD

This ripple without cable caps is very impressive.

Yup. Really impressive, nice work from Seasonic. The only thing I would like to see is digital system :(

McSteel 08-15-2016 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by breixobaloca (Post 128237)
The things that most impressed me were the capacitors. Nippon Chemi-Con series I NEVER saw on PSUs. Someone know about it?

CE on primary and W on secondary. I don't see any info on the website. Interesting :)

Tailor-made for Seasonic. You may see them elsewhere if SS didn't pay for exclusivity.

Quote:

Originally Posted by VSG (Post 128234)
Does the EVGA 750 P2 at $130 not affect scoring here? 80+ Platinum units were used before when rating 80+ Titanium units.

Just as a reference. The only fair comparison is among units of the same class, regardless of whether the price premium feels justified - feelings tend to be biased, and we're striving for objectivity in these evaluations... ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by HX520 (Post 128236)
Scan has it for 189.99. The G-750 is 100 and the HX750i (Platinum) is 132.99, so I don't think it's worthwhile at that price...

As above, that's a personal attitude towards cutting-edge tech, and I can respect that. Still no reason to dock this unit :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by schnopsnosn (Post 128235)
Well, the EVGA 750 T2 is $189.99 in the EVGA-store, so I don't see an issue with that.

Where I personally see an issue is the retail pricing in Europe. The lowest price for that unit I can find is €215,92.

EU is always going to be more expensive than US, nothing new there, sadly... Seeing stuff on the 'Egg that's 30% cheaper than over here will forever bring a bitter tear to my eye :p

Quote:

Originally Posted by breixobaloca (Post 128239)
Yup. Really impressive, nice work from Seasonic. The only thing I would like to see is digital system :(

Why? Obviously the analog implementation is just as good. What do you gain by going digital in this case? More complexity, more points of failure and higher price as well as somewhat lower efficiency at very low loads.

And hey, as far as I'm concerned, such precise tuning in full analog should be considered an art form :)

---

As for my own comments, did Seasonic give an official statement regarding the performance of the first sample? Does it belong to a known-not-as-impressive batch, do they claim it's a one-off, or is the performance variance significant on this model?

Otherwise, a well-deserved 10/10, would consider it a Prime example.

Great review, Wolfie!

Oklahoma Wolf 08-15-2016 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by McSteel (Post 128241)
As for my own comments, did Seasonic give an official statement regarding the performance of the first sample? Does it belong to a known-not-as-impressive batch, do they claim it's a one-off, or is the performance variance significant on this model?

There's a Seasonic rep on the forums - I'll let him comment on that as he likes. Last I heard they were still looking into it.

I did find some soldering related issues on my breakout board after my first test on it, but fixing those and retesting didn't improve things enough to get it to where the second unit got. Enough to move it from 1.6% average regulation to 1% though.

Should note the second unit used the first one's cables to get the review numbers. That's why I think it's something with the VRM in the first one.

Even the first one would have cleared a 9.8 total score :D

schnopsnosn 08-15-2016 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by McSteel (Post 128241)
EU is always going to be more expensive than US, nothing new there, sadly... Seeing stuff on the 'Egg that's 30% cheaper than over here will forever bring a bitter tear to my eye :p

I'm just glad we're not in Australia/New Zealand, even though Austrian prices bring tears to my eyes on a regular basis, just like the availability here. Most online-shops have unreliable stock-numbers because they don't keep more expensive parts, such as most PSUs, most GPUs and CPUs in stock and only order those parts from their supplier when necessary :rolleyes:

Seasonic Rep 08-15-2016 11:14 AM

Hi Guys, we sent the 2nd sample is because the first unit, being early production run in a small batch, our factory accidentally mixed in a wrong part. Some were ok, some not. We have since rectified this issue. Sorry.

TELVM 08-15-2016 11:22 AM

Is this a toroidal choke across primary/secondary?:

http://0.t.imgbox.com/tF6inp4S.jpg ... http://6.t.imgbox.com/rxzqKLCg.jpg

McSteel 08-15-2016 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seasonic Rep (Post 128252)
Hi Guys, we sent the 2nd sample is because the first unit, being early production run in a small batch, our factory accidentally mixed in a wrong part. Some were ok, some not. We have since rectified this issue. Sorry.

Thanks for the explanation! Makes sense, and should be forgivable in most users' minds.

Asking another difficult question: Even though the error doesn't actually break anything (just somewhat lessens the awesomeness of the unit), is it grounds for a return? If so, do you know the serial numbers of the affected units?

Personally, going by what Wolfie described, I'd be perfectly content with his unit #1 and those like it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TELVM (Post 128254)
Is this a toroidal choke across primary/secondary?:

http://0.t.imgbox.com/tF6inp4S.jpg ... http://6.t.imgbox.com/rxzqKLCg.jpg

That's a leakage inductance coil for the LLC converter... I might be horribly off, though.

HX520 08-15-2016 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by McSteel (Post 128241)
Just as a reference. The only fair comparison is among units of the same class, regardless of whether the price premium feels justified - feelings tend to be biased, and we're striving for objectivity in these evaluations... ;)

10/10 for performance, just not sure i'd give it 10 for value.

The EVGA has gone on sale and has a $30 MIR now: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...-063-_-Product

Price quibbles aside, we can agree the Prime lives up to the Seasonic reputation for quality.

hood6558 08-15-2016 12:15 PM

I've wanted one of these since Easter, when I was one of the winners in the Seasonic Easter Game contest. Unfortunately, all I won was a goody bag (marketing stuff, mini-screwdriver, LED keychain, Prime velcro wire ties, and Prime gummy bears! But no power supply). Actually the power supply winners received existing platinum and gold units, not titanium Prime units. So I guess I'll just have to buy one for my next build. Excellent review - 10/10 and 10 yr warranty, that's a very TENacious adversary, the new "gold standard" for titanium power supplies, so to speak...

turkey3_scratch 08-15-2016 12:26 PM

Super good :)

ef3393 08-15-2016 08:20 PM

could you double check the cable without capacitor??

Oklahoma Wolf 08-15-2016 08:48 PM

The cables don't have capacitors.

rares495 08-16-2016 04:23 AM

@Oklahoma Wolf

I wonder how this unit got a perfect 10 with those deviations in the transient tests. Yeah, i know they're all in spec but all top of the line units have been producing perfect lines for years now. To be honest, i feel like i've just read a paid review. I'm a bit disappointed...

quest for silence 08-16-2016 05:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rares495 (Post 128299)
To be honest, i feel like i've just read a paid review. I'm a bit disappointed...

Just for that?

I'm a bit disappointed too by the latest Seasonics (and their reviews) but, to be honest and kind, that expression ("a paid review") look like "some good trolling".

rares495 08-16-2016 05:19 AM

It's not just that, it's also things like "you know, I could go on for hours on this one..." when clearly it isn't THAT good. To me this 10 feels a bit far fetched and un-jonnyguru-y.

quest for silence 08-16-2016 05:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rares495 (Post 128302)
when clearly it isn't THAT good.

Even this affirmation is groundless (without further argumentations): in the OW's review that (second) unit actually performed THAT good, despite that latest, specific OW's comment.

rares495 08-16-2016 05:26 AM

Still doesn't feel like a perfect 10 to me. More like "let's give Seasonic a perfect 10 too cuz we love them yay" kind of review.

turkey3_scratch 08-16-2016 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rares495 (Post 128304)
Still doesn't feel like a perfect 10 to me. More like "let's give Seasonic a perfect 10 too cuz we love them yay" kind of review.

If you know OW you know he doesn't score against run-on transient tests unless they are out of spec. No reason to unfairly change his methodology for this review.

rares495 08-16-2016 07:47 AM

You're right but those lines being so straight is a pretty common thing and easily achievable so i thought a unit shouldn't get a perfect 10 while failing to deliver such a basic and trivial yet still important thing.

HexiumVII 08-16-2016 07:49 AM

The Prime is making me drool, but EVGA has the 750W T2 for $139 after rebate until today. The Prime 650W is $159 which is ok since i'm only running a single 1080. Also to the naysayers, this unit has 2-3% better efficienty at 10% and 20% loads than even the EVGA T2, which is the load most computers stay in. Thats like in another class on its own. Its like Diamond efficiency!

Oh man decisions decisions. What should i buy today!

McSteel 08-16-2016 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rares495 (Post 128304)
Still doesn't feel like a perfect 10 to me. More like "let's give Seasonic a perfect 10 too cuz we love them yay" kind of review.

Do you feel the other perfect-10 reviews posted over the years were also biased and unfounded in their praise of the reviewed unit? Please explain why if so, and please point out the differences if not.

If you are going to throw around accusations of fanboyism and illegitimacy for financial gain, then you also need to bear the burden of substantiating your allegations with more than "it just feels like it".

Otherwise, you're more than welcome to interpret the review in your own way, after looking at the facts as they are presented. Actually, you're openly invited to disagree with the scoring and the verdict, but not to dispute the methodology and the results without very concrete arguments.

Thank you! :)

-The_Mask- 08-16-2016 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HexiumVII (Post 128313)
What should i buy today!

A less overkill power supply? You probably be OK with a quality 400W PSU, 300W could even be enough, but it all depends on the other components.

Oklahoma Wolf 08-16-2016 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rares495 (Post 128299)
I wonder how this unit got a perfect 10 with those deviations in the transient tests.

Because I don't score those tests unless they violate ATX spec.

My bank account has two dollars in it. Nobody paid for this review but me... this is extremely financially unrewarding work.

GDILord 08-16-2016 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oklahoma Wolf (Post 128317)
this is extremely financially unrewarding work.

Does it help if we tell you that we appreciate it?

ef3393 08-16-2016 10:44 AM

appreciate it +1

turkey3_scratch 08-16-2016 12:41 PM

Yep so do I!

Tazz 08-16-2016 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rares495 (Post 128299)
I'm a bit disappointed...

A slight blip in the transient tests is all it takes to disappoint you? What else could there be? That thing showed stellar performance all the way around.

Sure like a few of the other sites, we received a second sample. It's not like the first unit failed and we asked for a second one (which happens). Seasonic actually notified us about the issue prior to Jeremy being able to complete the testing process. They could have waited to see if our unit presented the issue first and then informed us after the fact but they didn't. They did the honorable thing and contacted us, that alone should mean something.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rares495 (Post 128299)
To be honest, i feel like I've just read a paid review.

I don't know how "new" you are to the site, but we can see that you're new to the forums. It's been stated time and time again in the forums. Jeremy gets paid on a per review basis. It doesn't matter what make or model, what color or size, or even what race. He gets paid a set amount per review regardless of who sent it and if it passed or failed.

Maybe ask a question or two before you go throwing out accusations like that. Most don't think anything about it, but it's comments like that that could potentially harm a site or a reviewers credibility.

ehume 08-16-2016 08:00 PM

"can the rest of the line do this well? Good question. I look forward to finding out the answer."

Are there more models on the way?

My own PSU's are 5-6 years old, now. They ought to last a while but these look sweet. The 600w fanless and the 650W look interesting.

BTW -- fine review. Thanks for doing these. Your reviews are just technical enough for us non-techs to follow.

Oklahoma Wolf 08-16-2016 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ehume (Post 128348)
Are there more models on the way?

They're already here. Next one's about 4 weeks out or so.

solomonshv 08-16-2016 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rares495 (Post 128304)
Still doesn't feel like a perfect 10 to me. More like "let's give Seasonic a perfect 10 too cuz we love them yay" kind of review.

if this PSU doesn't get a perfect 10 then no PSU should get a perfect 10.
-it achieves amazing ripple suppression and voltage regulation WITHOUT using a DSP or in-cable capacitors. this greatly reduces possible points of failure.
-93% efficiency at 10% load on a 115V input.... it doesn't just meet titanium spec, it destroys it.
-it's priced pretty reasonable, especially when you consider that there is nothing else like it. EVGA's/Super Flower's T2 use cable capacitors (which make sit as pain to custom sleeve the cables) and other competitors just don't perform as well.

mdk777 08-16-2016 11:56 PM

Time for a "get those dang kids off my lawn" post.;)

Some people just haven't been around long enough to remember when the PSU itself was a major source of heat...

When you were burning 400 watts with a .70 efficiency PSU...

172 watts of heat being used by the PSU alone.

So yeah, getting to 93 % is really pushing the limit.

Many years ago, saying that you had reached perfection, a 10 out of 10 was a very subjective rating...obviously there was just a shed load of room for better.

I guess they could start taking away 1/100 points now

Start 9.99 rating to differentiate from the 9.97 units. :lol::D:wtf:

Seasonic Rep 08-17-2016 08:55 AM

@rares495

I am very sorry we are not able to please you and that you are not satisfied with OW's scoring. Our R&D have worked long and hard on the PRIME project and this is the best product we have brought to market in our 41 years of history. We are very proud of our PRIME and at the same time we are very grateful to OW to bestow the highest score on our product.

It is a bit sad to read your posts accusing us of paying for the review as this is something we have never done and never will do. I really hope you will be able to find something worthwhile to do with your time, be constructive and add value to this excellent Forum.

Thank you.

cruzinforit 08-17-2016 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seasonic Rep (Post 128359)
@rares495

I am very sorry we are not able to please you and that you are not satisfied with OW's scoring. Our R&D have worked long and hard on the PRIME project and this is the best product we have brought to market in our 41 years of history. We are very proud of our PRIME and at the same time we are very grateful to OW to bestow the highest score on our product.

It is a bit sad to read your posts accusing us of paying for the review as this is something we have never done and never will do. I really hope you will be able to find something worthwhile to do with your time, be constructive and add value to this excellent Forum.

Thank you.

:lol::lol::lol:

This has to be the most polite "fuck off m8" I've ever read in my entire life. Don't misunderstand, I 100% agree, this is an excellent product. The transient isn't perfect, but it doesn't need to be and is obviously within the ATX spec. And it won't ever make a difference in anything ever. It's pretty clear this unit actually deserves the 10/10 rating it received.


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